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Author Topic: 1/24 Iwata Asks Vol. 3: Versus, Co-op and Share (New Revelations)*  (Read 833 times)
dcmjlive
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« on: January 24, 2008, 03:01:08 AM »

For this update, I decided to highlight stuff for all the people who don't really like reading this kind of stuff. Trying to be like Sakurai in thinking of the fans. Those in RED are the striking revelations. Those in GREEN have something to do with the RED revelations.

Concepts Shared from the Start

Iwata
As I mentioned in the beginning, Smash Bros. Brawl for the Wii was a title that many players wanted for Wi-Fi play. Therefore, making Super Smash Bros. Brawl available online in one form or another was a necessary premise.

Sakurai
Right. This was conveyed to me at the E3 in May of 2005 and two months later on July 7, 2005, I finished the project plan document for Super Smash Bros. Brawl. (See document)


Iwata
Since it was you that wrote the document, most of the features found in the final version of Smash Bros. Brawl are extremely close to what was written in the document.


Sakurai
Well, there were lots of things that didn’t make it into the document too. At any rate, in the report, I covered, for the most part, how to deal with the online aspect for Smash Bros. Brawl. For example, when battling through the internet, a player has the option to brawl With Friends or With Anyone. When playing With Friends, you can compose short messages, (See document) but when brawling with random players, however, names aren’t displayed and neither records nor brawling results are saved. (See document) This was very similar to what Nintendo was proposing for its Wi-Fi Connection (WFC), but at the time I finished the document in July of 2005, the WFC service didn’t exist.


Iwata
Not that we didn’t have it…we were actually in the middle of development. Naturally, we weren’t letting anyone else know what we were working on and I didn’t talk about any detailed features or concepts when I asked you to work on Smash Bros.


Sakurai
Yet, when we swapped the Smash Bros. Brawl document and the project plan for the Nintendo WFC and compared features, there was a great deal of correlation.


Iwata
It was quite surprising. (laughs) To me, online gaming had always been a place for the strong. One person would be living it up while hundreds or thousands of people were unhappy. I can’t completely reject this model of course, but as long as things remain this way, online gaming can spread only so far no matter what you do. I mean, even if people thought it looked interesting, most would hesitate to get involved and stay lingering on the sidelines.


Sakurai
Right.


Iwata
Therefore, we tried to think of ways to avoid this form of online gaming and ways to fashion an environment in which parents would feel safe letting their children play games online, debating at length on topics like how to create an online environment free of harassment. As a result, our concept of the WFC slowly began to take shape with two separate modes of play; players could play with friends or play with people they don’t know. It would be more about the fun of sharing rather than simply competing. Amazingly, these were the proposals I found in the first document you gave me.


Sakurai
That’s right. When people think of playing Smash Bros. online, they think about battling opponents to see what happens based on their record of wins or losses, or about holding tournaments online. But I felt that this would make it a service from which only a select group of players could derive enjoyment. For Smash Bros., there are small communities here and there where there’s fun in winning and losing, even when there are more skilled players than others. But if you make an environment where everyone is trying to climb their way to the top of a single tall mountain, it’s clear that the people having fun would be limited to a small number of individuals.



Iwata
Those in the top five might feel pretty good about themselves, but what happens if you’re number 15,398 in the rankings? People considered formidable in their own particular community wouldn’t be the least bit pleased.


Sakurai
Furthermore, since Smash Bros. is likely to have a broad gaming base, those that enjoy playing it within their own community might still end up number 100,000 in the rankings.


Iwata
We were in nearly complete agreement on these things without ever having talked about it. Maybe it was because of our long experience of working together...or possibly our shared roots. (laughs)


Sakurai
(laughs)

Versus, Co-op and Share
Iwata
As long as we’re on the topic, why don’t we talk about the details of playing Super Smash Bros. Brawl through the internet?

Sakurai
Sure. Of course, you can battle with others. However, I also wanted to offer other primary forms of game play and, ultimately, created three different elements: Versus, Co-op (cooperative game play) and Share. (See document) As we discussed earlier, with Versus, you have the option to battle With Friends or With Anyone. Of course, players can also fight in free-for-alls, or two can compete in challenges like the Home-Run Contest.


Iwata
Oh, I see.


Sakurai
You can attack the Sandbag together at the same time, or you can change the setup to something like a track and field event and take turns hitting two sandbags with the player hitting it the farthest being named the winner. You’d be surprised by how fired up you can get! (laughs)


Iwata
Like when playing a time trial mode, there’s not a lot of emotion when playing alone. Playing against someone, however, seems to add some unique pressure.


Sakurai
Exactly. Moving on, Co-op offers cooperative play in which players form teams to compete in contests like the Team Multi-Man Brawl. Also, when participating in a Brawl, you can form teams not just with your Friends but with Anyone, which has both elements of Versus and Co-op.


Iwata
Really? In With Anyone you can battle as a team?


Sakurai
Right.



Iwata
Are the teams formed randomly?


Sakurai
Yes. When four people play together, they’re assigned randomly to fight two-on-two.


Iwata
That means that you can team up and play with someone you don’t even know.


Sakurai
Right. When four players get together, there’s going to be those who always place third or fourth. However, with the opportunity to be partnered with a stronger player, they now have the chance to taste the thrill of victory.


Iwata
I see.


Sakurai
Lastly, the Share feature enables you to exchange Snapshots or have them distributed by Nintendo’s server.


Iwata
Versus and Co-op features both look like fun, but I think the Share feature might just be the sort of unique fun that Smash Bros. Brawl can make by utilizing the internet.


Sakurai
Right. In addition to exchanging Snapshots, a gamer can post and receive stages that have been edited with the Stage Builder feature. In order to provide a better explanation, perhaps I should talk about the Stage Builder first.

Stage Builder
Sakurai
Simply stated, the Stage Builder enables players to build their own stages. Just like the name says, right? (laughs) (See document) By combining several different components, like platforms, the width of the stage, and traps, players are free, to a certain extent, to create their own stages. They can upload these stages to Nintendo’s server, where it is then sent to other players. In other words, once everyday, a new stage made by someone, somewhere can be sent to your Wii.


Iwata
And the stages sent in this way then disappear.


Sakurai
Right. We figured making these stages available for just one day would make it more interesting.


Iwata
Treasuring every encounter, right?


Sakurai
Right. We wanted players to look forward to these encounters.


Iwata
And, if the stages piled up, it would be difficult to choose from such an endless supply. I think it’s the right decision considering that players have a limited amount of time to play games.


Sakurai
Right. I thought it would be easier to understand and more fun if a new stage was available for play everyday. Personally, I’m a fan of having new experiences each time you play.


Iwata
I see.


Sakurai
Ultimately, I think the reason for bringing people together to play via the internet is to make each gaming experience unique. After all, the incentives for going online to view blogs that are continually updated and those that are not are very different.


Iwata
I agree. But the required time and effort increases when you try and make something like that. Enabling players to design their own stages, upload them to the server and then send them to other Wii consoles, well, it’s clear doing things like that will be pretty difficult.



Sakurai
You can say that again. (laughs) At the same time, however, these are things you can accomplish with the right amount of effort and it’s not something that you can’t do if you find the help and build the system.


Iwata
So it’s not impossible.


Sakurai
Right. The more effort you invest, the bigger the payoff in terms of fun. This is true of exchanging Snapshots too; players come up with forms of game play that we would never think of on our own. In this way, our resources are limited only by the number of our players, and it would be a waste not to let players enjoy the ideas of other players.


Iwata
I agree. Nowadays, just looking at the Check Mii Out Channel shows how the ideas of our players outpace our own.


Sakurai
Right.


Iwata
I’m truly impressed by Wii players. They come up with ways to play and use the Wii that would never occur to us.


Sakurai
Another reason we incorporated the Stage Builder was simply to make it possible for players to get more out of the stages. In Smash Bros. Melee, for example, Big Blue and Poké Floats were known as challenging stages to play.


Iwata
It’s not that they were hard per se, but there were so many formidable obstacles that caused the unexpected to happen.


Sakurai
Exactly! (laughs) This time around, however, we refrained from using many stages like these. The backgrounds might change dramatically, but most large walls and ceilings were removed since we were aiming for simple, easy-to-maneuver stages. Yet, part of the appeal of the Smash Bros. series is that the unexpected can happen on more extreme stages. It would feel wrong if these challenging stages were missing from this title, so we decided to use the Stage Builder as a means of filling the gap.



Iwata
I see. In addition to offering conventional stages with standard play, you were hoping that players would make stages encouraging a high degree of improvisation.


Sakurai
Exactly. We wanted players to make some messed up stages for others to try.

Super Smash Bros. Spectator
Iwata
So, with the Share feature, players are able to share Snapshots, stages and…


Sakurai
…Replay. Replay enables players to record one entire match and replay it. That way, for example, you can play Target Smash!! mode and send a recording to your friends proving that "hey man, I cleared this in just 5 seconds!" Of course, you can also use this for memorable Brawls and such.


Iwata
It’s a blast to watch impressive Smash Bros. battles. One of my personal sayings is that a fun game is one you can enjoy just by watching. Smash Bros. is truly one that’s fun to watch.


Sakurai
That’s why I hope players are looking forward to Spectator. I think this will be a big part of the new title.


Iwata
The Super Smash Bros. Spectator?


Sakurai
Right. Super Smash Bros. Spectator. (laughs) With this feature, you can record a Brawl and share it once it’s been posted to Nintendo’s server. (See document)


Iwata
In other words, this mode enables you to become a Brawl spectator.


Sakurai
Right. I’m not sure how it will work out, but I really wanted to make it happen this time around.



Iwata
Right. Because watching talented players compete at Smash Bros. tournaments is a lot of fun.


Sakurai
Memorable Brawls, like sports broadcast on TV, can be sent to other Wiis.


Iwata
Wow, I can hardly wait. You know though, all we’ve talked about so far are the network features and we already covered this much.


Sakurai
Yeah, we haven’t even breached the surface of the most fundamental features of the game! (laughs)


Iwata
Right you are. Well then, let’s start talking about them.


(To be continued)
« Last Edit: May 25, 2008, 10:48:13 AM by imaginary_unit » Logged


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Goldensun
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« Reply #1 on: January 24, 2008, 05:17:42 AM »

Can you make a list of Shocking Revelations , I'm too lazy to read the whole article.
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dcmjlive
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« Reply #2 on: January 24, 2008, 05:22:44 AM »

Can you make a list of Shocking Revelations , I'm too lazy to read the whole article.

It's in italics anyway...haha. Just look for it. Smiley
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Goldensun
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« Reply #3 on: January 24, 2008, 05:30:20 AM »

It's in italics anyway...haha. Just look for it. Smiley

Awwwggg, finnneeeeee ill do it meselffff gosh!...... Tongue
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dcmjlive
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« Reply #4 on: January 24, 2008, 05:32:11 AM »

Awwwggg, finnneeeeee ill do it meselffff gosh!...... Tongue

Fine, I'll change the color so it's easier to see. HAHA.
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« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2008, 06:03:18 AM »

Fine, I'll change the color so it's easier to see. HAHA.

YAY!!!!   Cheesy
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« Reply #6 on: January 24, 2008, 06:05:07 AM »

Thank you for the color coding I was scrolling down to see how large the passage was and the color coding made me go right to the good parts but you should put the info on color on the top I had read the whole first paragraph before I got bored and scrolled down  Grin
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« Reply #7 on: January 24, 2008, 06:09:11 AM »

Big Blue and Pokefloats were my least favourite stages.

I won't miss them if they're not included.

But Mute City is a must!
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« Reply #8 on: January 24, 2008, 06:41:39 AM »

This does give us a lot of revelations.  I'm glad we didn't only recieve gameplay videos today. 
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« Reply #9 on: January 24, 2008, 06:44:11 AM »

This does give us a lot of revelations.  I'm glad we didn't only recieve gameplay videos today. 

Well...it's this that made the day worthwhile. I think the videos are just a sad update. I hoped for something more substantial.
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« Reply #10 on: January 24, 2008, 06:54:33 AM »

Well...it's this that made the day worthwhile. I think the videos are just a sad update. I hoped for something more substantial.

Haha yeah, it was cool to see gameplay but it made me want to play it that much more.  Made me think "DAMN YOU STOP HAVING SO MUCH FUN AND GIVE US THE GAME ALREADY!"
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« Reply #11 on: January 24, 2008, 07:55:23 AM »

It's funny.  I was just reading an article about on-line jackasses ("griefers") when it occurred to me: the Griefer community must be hating Sakurai right now!  With Brawl's "fight everyone," griefers can't anger random strangers much beyond corpse-humping, can they?  Oh sure, they might anger a few people using cheap tricks, but the random nature of matches means they can't hide from superior players or stalk particularly vulnerable ones.  Nor can griefers enjoy the frustrated reactions of their opponents even if they do succeed.  They will get little more satisfaction then if they were raping AIs, and let's face it: that's not much fun for a griefer.  They live for the reaction, and the reaction a griefer gets, even if they should bring someone to tears in real life, will only be the stoic silence of a video-game character.  The only way a griefer can taunt his foes is with the pre-supplied taunts, at the cost of leaving themselves vulnerable.
Hell, if Nintendo starts supplying balance patches, griefers won't even be able to abuse character imbalances to flood the battlefield with cheap characters...
EDIT: Modified as per DJ's suggestions.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2008, 08:30:46 AM by BewareOfUmbrella » Logged

dcmjlive
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« Reply #12 on: January 24, 2008, 07:59:41 AM »

It's funny.  I was just reading an article about on-line jackasses ("griefers") when it occurred to me: they must be hating Sakurai right now!  They can't anger random strangers much beyond corpse-humping, can they?  Oh sure, they might anger a few people using cheap tricks, but the random nature of matches means they can't hide from superior players or stalk particularly vulnerable ones.  Nor can they enjoy the frustrated reactions of their opponents even if they do succeed.  They will get little more satisfaction then if they were raping AIs, and let's face it: that's not much fun for a griefer.  They live for the reaction, and the reaction they get, even if they should bring someone to tears in real life, will only be stoic silence.  The only way they can taunt their foes is with the pre-supplied taunts, at the cost of leaving themselves vulnerable to what's coming.
Hell, if Nintendo starts supplying balance patches, griefers won't even be able to abuse character imbalances to flood the battlefield with cheap characters...

What? HAHA. Sorry but it's kinda late here and I just didn't understand you. Please explain. Thanks! Your use of they is too ambiguous. I don't know if you're referring to Sakurai and Iwata or the griefers.
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« Reply #13 on: January 24, 2008, 08:11:50 AM »

when i first saw these iwata volume thingies i ignored them, but having read this one they're actually pretty interesting.
but will we be able to brawl overseas? volume 4: online interview again please but this time about worldwide brawling,iwata
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« Reply #14 on: January 24, 2008, 04:30:49 PM »

Well, it looks as if DJ and BoU had things under control. (laughs)
A color-coded system plus a graphic verbal spanking to the "griefers" to boot.
Thankfully, this will make my list of observations a lot shorter. Nicely done guys.

Reactions to "Concepts Shared from the Start,"
1. Aww, no personalized taunts via "With Anyone." Oh well, it's probably for the best.
2. Iwata points out, "online gaming had always been a place for the strong." Well not anymore. Consider the days of "King of the Hill" - or as Sakurai describes it, "a single tall mountain" - officially over.
3. Broad gaming base + hassle-free environment = longevity factor. (Nintendo's ace in the hole is just that)

Reactions to "Versus, Co-op and Share,"
1. The Co-op Home-Run Contest and Team Multi-Man Brawl are sure to bring plenty of people together while taking out their frustration on the defenseless Sandbag and the "Alloy Rangers."
2. "With Anyone" Team Battle Random Partners. Genius. No more will the griefers get their jollies out of abusing noobs.
3. Snapshots. The very thought of this makes me cheer and cringe at the same time.

Reactions to "Stage Builder,"
1. Iwata says that we should "[treasure] every encounter." (A wild STAGE appeared!)
2. Something tells me I'll lose a lot of sleep simply trying to come up with new stages plus trying out other people's creations.
3. Iwata says "just looking at the Check Mii Out Channel shows how the ideas of our players outpace our own." (They must have seen the various "creative" facial features of some...)
4. Hopefully, Poké Floats will be replaced by something more appropriate. (c'mon [Insert Name] City...)

Reactions to "Super Smash Bros. Spectator"
1. The Replay feature sounds extremely fun. I agree with Iwata, watching a pro can be awe-inspiring.
2. Even though most of the members may not be able to play each other via Wi-Fi, we can still share our match footage. (I hope there'll be a regional smashpower tourney at some point...)

I wasn't expecting the extra time I was alloted thanks to the aforementioned members.
I suppose I'll stick around and peruse some of the other threads...
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